Idit 博士畢業(yè)于哈佛大學(xué)和麻省理工學(xué)院，她是全球知名的教育和新媒體專(zhuān)家。MaMaMedia INC.CEO和創(chuàng)始人。我們就口語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)專(zhuān)題專(zhuān)門(mén)采訪了IDIT，請(qǐng)她就中國(guó)的口語(yǔ)教學(xué)以及怎樣更好地學(xué)習(xí)英語(yǔ)口語(yǔ)發(fā)表了自己的觀點(diǎn)。
SAYBOT：在中國(guó)現(xiàn)在有越來(lái)越多的人在學(xué)習(xí)英語(yǔ)，但是有許多人學(xué)了許多年卻仍然不會(huì)說(shuō)英語(yǔ)，您覺(jué)得大的問(wèn)題在哪里？
IDIT：為了更好地學(xué)會(huì)說(shuō)英語(yǔ)，人們應(yīng)該堅(jiān)持練習(xí)英語(yǔ)對(duì)話。許多中國(guó)學(xué)生并沒(méi)有得到充分的口語(yǔ)練習(xí)，因?yàn)樗麄儧](méi)有好的內(nèi)容。閱讀和寫(xiě)做對(duì)英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者來(lái)說(shuō)是非常有用，但是對(duì)口語(yǔ)練習(xí)是不夠的。而且，人們同樣需要提高聽(tīng)力來(lái)幫助他們進(jìn)行口語(yǔ)練習(xí)。后，為了更好地進(jìn)行英語(yǔ)會(huì)話，我們必須熟悉各種發(fā)音，比如：美式、英式、澳大利亞式的英語(yǔ)，以及兒童口音、成人口音和各種行業(yè)的口音，這樣可以用來(lái)掌握各種說(shuō)話的系統(tǒng)并且學(xué)習(xí)怎樣在各種語(yǔ)境和環(huán)境下來(lái)更好地表達(dá)自己。
SAYBOT：有許多人在中國(guó)接受了高等教育，但是他們的語(yǔ)言水平有時(shí)可能不如一個(gè)本土英語(yǔ)國(guó)家的小孩。您覺(jué)得根本的原因在哪里？是根本學(xué)習(xí)方式不同還是其他的原因？
IDIT: 在中國(guó)許多人接受過(guò)高等教育，我們可以看到他們閱讀和寫(xiě)作能力都很不錯(cuò)，但是他們流利清晰地說(shuō)好英語(yǔ)的能力卻很有限。他們?nèi)鄙儆幸饬x的、吸引人的、有趣的內(nèi)容來(lái)練習(xí)口語(yǔ)。我們知道中國(guó)人可以學(xué)好英語(yǔ)，比如你可以去看看那些在美國(guó)留學(xué)的人們——他們真的說(shuō)得很好！所以這是有可能的！
SAYBOT：在我們傳統(tǒng)的英語(yǔ)教學(xué)方法中，我們會(huì)背好多單詞，做好多練習(xí)，許多人為了考試而讀英語(yǔ)。但是在日常生活中，卻使用不出來(lái)，您覺(jué)得我們傳統(tǒng)英語(yǔ)教學(xué)離快速掌握英語(yǔ)的方法有多遠(yuǎn)？
IDIT: 通過(guò)記憶和背誦英語(yǔ)單詞來(lái)學(xué)英語(yǔ)從系統(tǒng)化的角度來(lái)說(shuō)并不是一無(wú)可取的。英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者的確需要通過(guò)一個(gè)詞一個(gè)詞地記憶來(lái)擴(kuò)大詞匯量。但是這一方式必須結(jié)合每天和真人進(jìn)行有關(guān)的生活或工作相關(guān)的有趣的日常會(huì)話，包括聊一些有關(guān)于興趣和愛(ài)好的話題。
我認(rèn)為口語(yǔ)結(jié)合了以下三種系統(tǒng)方法：1）記憶單詞 2）逐詞逐句練習(xí) 3）把新學(xué)到的詞句立刻應(yīng)用到真實(shí)的對(duì)話和解決問(wèn)題的場(chǎng)景中——這是學(xué)習(xí)口語(yǔ)好的方法
我把這種學(xué)習(xí)方法叫做：邊學(xué)邊做。作為學(xué)習(xí)方法學(xué)家，我做了多年的研究發(fā)現(xiàn)那些英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者：無(wú)論是年輕的還是年老的，都不能真正地恰當(dāng)?shù)卣莆蘸蛻?yīng)用新學(xué)的知識(shí)（無(wú)論是數(shù)學(xué)、科學(xué)、技術(shù)、商務(wù)或者語(yǔ)言藝術(shù)等），除非他們能徹底地投入并著手于相關(guān)的活動(dòng)才使這些知識(shí)對(duì)他們個(gè)人來(lái)說(shuō)有有真實(shí)的意義。
SAYBOT：您覺(jué)得怎樣在英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)中，是記憶更重要，還是說(shuō)話更重要？怎樣才能更簡(jiǎn)單地學(xué)英語(yǔ)？
IDIT: 我們學(xué)習(xí)一門(mén)新的語(yǔ)言，好的辦法就是要不斷地說(shuō)！但是記?。翰灰缓妥约赫f(shuō)！語(yǔ)言學(xué)習(xí)者如果他有興趣學(xué)習(xí)口語(yǔ)，好有一位那門(mén)語(yǔ)言的母語(yǔ)者，這樣可以來(lái)傾聽(tīng)他們的對(duì)話，并且告訴他們接近和相關(guān)的表達(dá)方式；本土語(yǔ)言者可以告訴他們對(duì)話中的相關(guān)內(nèi)容，也可以為他們指出語(yǔ)法和發(fā)音中的錯(cuò)誤。他們具有豐富的教學(xué)知識(shí)可以更正他們的口語(yǔ)，鼓勵(lì)他們、幫助學(xué)習(xí)者達(dá)到一個(gè)新的水平。
任何口語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者必須經(jīng)常在日常生活對(duì)話中來(lái)進(jìn)行鍛煉，否則他們很快會(huì)失去熱情中止學(xué)習(xí)。
這就是“邊學(xué)邊做”理論。但是我們也說(shuō)：探戈需要兩個(gè)人才能跳”。也就是說(shuō)兩個(gè)人來(lái)學(xué)習(xí)一門(mén)語(yǔ)言是一種很好的方法。理想的語(yǔ)言學(xué)習(xí)者的身邊需要一位本國(guó)語(yǔ)言者（一個(gè)完美的舞伴），他是一位很好的傾聽(tīng)者，他可以理解你的興趣和動(dòng)機(jī)，他也是一位好的指導(dǎo)者，他知道怎樣不斷地鞭策英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者，使他們進(jìn)行完美的語(yǔ)言學(xué)習(xí)舞蹈！
SAYBOT：目前中國(guó)出現(xiàn)了許多英語(yǔ)培訓(xùn)機(jī)構(gòu)，比如以考試類(lèi)為主的新東方，以提高口語(yǔ)為主的華爾街，您怎么看待這些培訓(xùn)學(xué)校，他們會(huì)給傳統(tǒng)的英語(yǔ)教學(xué)方式怎樣的沖擊？
IDIT：:我沒(méi)有親身體驗(yàn)過(guò)這些特殊的訓(xùn)練中心和他們的語(yǔ)言環(huán)境。所以我不能從親身體驗(yàn)來(lái)評(píng)論他們。但是我聽(tīng)說(shuō)他們收費(fèi)很高。
我認(rèn)為華爾街的英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)以“英語(yǔ)角”而出名，你可以付費(fèi)，可以和真人進(jìn)行真實(shí)的英語(yǔ)對(duì)話，是一個(gè)非常好的形式。我也認(rèn)為華爾街在使用技術(shù)——我指的是軟件。雖然我沒(méi)有使用過(guò)，我認(rèn)為使用技術(shù)“邊學(xué)邊做”的理論是很重要的。如果做得正確，技術(shù)為英語(yǔ)口語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)的過(guò)程帶來(lái)很大的幫助。
SAYBOT：說(shuō)寶堂的口語(yǔ)教學(xué)是比較新型的口語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)方法，它是通過(guò)人機(jī)全方位的互動(dòng)學(xué)習(xí)，來(lái)幫助大家練口語(yǔ)，這種學(xué)習(xí)方式和傳統(tǒng)的英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)方法有了很大的不同。您對(duì)SAYBOT的教學(xué)軟件怎么看？
IDIT：說(shuō)寶堂公司在英語(yǔ)口語(yǔ)教學(xué)中找到了一種完全不同以往的新方法。實(shí)際上，他們創(chuàng)造了革命性的教學(xué)口語(yǔ)方法。說(shuō)寶堂用有效的方式將和有效的學(xué)習(xí)理論用強(qiáng)有力的技術(shù)結(jié)合起來(lái)，因此達(dá)到了前面所說(shuō)的兩大佳學(xué)習(xí)方式： 1）邊學(xué)邊做 2）探戈需要兩個(gè)人來(lái)跳。
而且，說(shuō)寶堂的產(chǎn)品和服務(wù)是為中國(guó)英語(yǔ)口語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者量身定做的。說(shuō)寶堂用好的技術(shù)來(lái)開(kāi)發(fā)設(shè)計(jì)各種全程生動(dòng)的教學(xué)參與和全互動(dòng)課程，這樣可以隨時(shí)隨地幫助中國(guó)人來(lái)學(xué)習(xí)真正地說(shuō)英語(yǔ)，這樣可以幫助他們找到更好的工作、到國(guó)外旅游、在商業(yè)中決勝，或者得到更好的托福成績(jī)。
說(shuō)寶堂和中國(guó)傳統(tǒng)的英語(yǔ)教學(xué)有很大的不同，和其他一些培訓(xùn)機(jī)構(gòu)比如新東方、華爾街也有很大不同。但從另一方面說(shuō)，說(shuō)寶堂的產(chǎn)品結(jié)合了許多優(yōu)秀的英語(yǔ)教學(xué)的英語(yǔ)教學(xué)方式。他與那些傳統(tǒng)的教學(xué)方法和培訓(xùn)機(jī)構(gòu)模式可以互相合作。這也是說(shuō)寶堂產(chǎn)品的美妙之處。
體驗(yàn)了說(shuō)寶堂的產(chǎn)品你會(huì)發(fā)現(xiàn)：它具有所有高質(zhì)量效果英語(yǔ)所具備的一切重要特質(zhì)： 1）練習(xí)真實(shí)的生活對(duì)話 2）有人傾聽(tīng)并及時(shí)糾正你所犯的錯(cuò)誤 3）內(nèi)容非常有趣吸引人，并且和你的每日生活息息有關(guān) 4）可承受的價(jià)格，隨時(shí)隨地便利使用。所有您所做的只要可以上網(wǎng)和一副耳機(jī)！這真是美妙極了。
SAYBOT：您覺(jué)得未來(lái)五年內(nèi)，英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)方法會(huì)有著怎樣的改變？是延續(xù)傳統(tǒng)教學(xué)呢，還是會(huì)有新的方法所代替？?jī)烧咧g是否會(huì)有矛盾？英語(yǔ)教學(xué)的遠(yuǎn)景又是如何？
IDIT: 在今后的年月里，在中國(guó)人學(xué)習(xí)英語(yǔ)口語(yǔ)的歷程中，說(shuō)寶堂在創(chuàng)造一個(gè)極具影響力的革命。他的服務(wù)價(jià)廉物美，使用非常方便，在中國(guó)任何地方都可以使用。他還將 “機(jī)會(huì)均等”介紹給高質(zhì)量的英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者。在網(wǎng)上有一些免費(fèi)的樣品，每個(gè)人都可以試用。產(chǎn)品價(jià)格不高，所以每個(gè)人多多少少地可以使用。所有想提高英語(yǔ)的人應(yīng)該來(lái)試一下。我非常認(rèn)真自信地來(lái)講這些話的。
另外一個(gè)非常好的特征就是說(shuō)寶堂建立了一個(gè)可以?xún)A聽(tīng)客戶(hù)反饋的技術(shù)框架系統(tǒng)。從開(kāi)始的時(shí)候，說(shuō)寶堂就鼓勵(lì)他們的使用者及時(shí)給他們反饋，可以贊揚(yáng)、也可以抱怨，也可以提供建議，甚至可以建議內(nèi)容和主題！說(shuō)寶堂的課程開(kāi)發(fā)設(shè)計(jì)完全是在用戶(hù)體驗(yàn)的基礎(chǔ)上進(jìn)行的。他們將以客戶(hù)的需求為目的：這集中體現(xiàn)在新的WEB2.0里?，F(xiàn)在，試問(wèn)有沒(méi)有其他的公司做到這一點(diǎn)？
在中國(guó)，找到一位優(yōu)秀的英語(yǔ)老師很不容易，他必須是流利的本土語(yǔ)言者，可以來(lái)聽(tīng)你所說(shuō)的并及時(shí)給你糾正你的發(fā)音、水平和語(yǔ)法，也可以在你的學(xué)習(xí)周期和和你便利學(xué)習(xí)的時(shí)間內(nèi)教你！如果要達(dá)到那樣的水平的私人老師將會(huì)是一大巨大的開(kāi)支！而說(shuō)寶堂把這個(gè)變?yōu)槊總€(gè)人都可以實(shí)現(xiàn)的夢(mèng)想——這也是說(shuō)寶堂為中國(guó)社會(huì)商業(yè)教育的進(jìn)步和發(fā)展所做的另一個(gè)偉大的貢獻(xiàn)！
IDIT: Saybot can help you learing spoken English simplely
Idit Harel is founder, Chairman and CEO of MaMaMedia. Idit Harel has been developing and introducing new-media technologies to kids since the early 80's - the earliest days of the personal computer. One of the first graduates of Harvard's Education Technology Program and the MIT Media Lab, Harel founded MaMaMedia in 1995, in NYC
Question: In China, more and more people are studying English. About 350 million people per year! But a lot of people still cannot speak English well. What do you think the key problem is?
Idit: In order to learn how to speak, a person needs to practice speaking on a regular basis. Most Chinese English-learners do not practice speaking often enough. They have no good contexts for doing that. Learning to read and write can be helpful in the English language learning process, but it is not sufficient for learning to how to speak English. In addition, a person needs to practice listening to English speakers in order to learn how to speak. Finally, in order to speak really well, people must practice listening to many different kinds of accents and pronunciations (e.g., American, British, or Australian; children, adults, or various professionals) and to different kinds of styles of speaking (street-speak, academic-speak, media-speak) and learn to respond and express themselves accordingly to fit with various contexts and situations.
Question: Even among the people in China who received high education, the spoken-English level is much lower than that of young children in any native English-speaking country. What do you think is the essential reason for this phenomenon? Is it the different way they learn English? Any other reasons come to mind?
Idit: Even among the people who received their higher education in China, we can see that they may be able to read and write well, but have limitations in their ability to speak English fluently and clearly. They lack practicing their speaking in meaningful, engaging, and fun contexts. We know Chinese people can learn to speak English well. For example, look at those who came to study in the USA – they speak really well! So it’s possible!
Question: Following the traditional way of teaching English in China, we are often taught to recite and memorize a lot of words, and we do many word-by-word speaking exercises. A lot of people study English words for tests. They may do well on these tests, and their vocabulary may be large, but they cannot speak English in their daily lives. What do you think is the reason for this? What’s the best way to grasp the “real” spoken English?
Idit: Learning to memorize and recite English words in a systematic way is not all bad. English language learners do need to memorize words and practice them through word-by-word speaking exercises, in order to enlarge and enrich their vocabulary. But it must be integrated with additional, daily practicing of speaking with someone real, talking about fun topics from their real daily lives, or work-related topics, or listening and chatting about their interests and hobbies.
I believe that the combination of the three systems – 1) memorizing words, 2) word-by-word speaking exercises, and 3) applying all newly-learned words immediately to real conversational situations or real problem-solving situation -- is the best way to grasp the “real” spoken English.
This philosophy of learning is what I call “l(fā)earning by doing.” My many years of research as a learning theorist indicate that learners, young and old, cannot really appropriate information and own any new knowledge (in mathematics, sciences, technology, business, or in language arts) unless they are thoroughly engaged in hands-on activities that are real and personally-meaningful to them.
Question: Which do you think is more important: 1) receiving good training in the memorizing of words, or 2) in the speaking of real English words and sentences? How we can learn to speak “real” English more easily and more simply?
Idit: We learn a new language best by speaking it. Speaking, speaking, speaking it. But: not just speaking to myself! Language learners, who are interested in learning to speak the language, must have a native speaker who is listening to them, and responds to what they say in a meaningful and relevant way; a native speaker who can relate to the content of the conversation, but can also relate to their specific grammatical mistakes and mispronunciation, and has the pedagogical knowledge of correcting and inspiring their speaking, coaching and taking the learner to the next level.
Any spoken-language learner must experience often, daily, a conversation that is meaningful to him/her, or else they’ll quickly get un-engaged and stop the learning process.
So it is about the “Learning by Doing” theory, but, we also say “It takes two to Tango.” What I mean is that it takes two people to learn to speak a language. Any learner needs a partner on the other side that is a native speaker (an expert Tango dancer), who is also a good listener, who understands the learner’s interests and motivation, and can be a good coach who knows how to continue to engage the learner in the spoken-language learning dance!
Question: There are many successful English-Language Training Schools in China, such as, the New Orient and Wall Street English. What do you regard as the best thing about these training schools? How do they enhance the teaching of spoken English?
Idit: I have never experienced these specific training centers and their learning environments. So I cannot speak about them from first-hand experience. What I heard from others is that they cost a lot and that they are not so good in producing results, that is producing fluent English Speakers.
I think Wall Street English is known for its “English Corners” where you can pay to come to speak real English with real people – so that’s a good feature. I also think Wall Street English uses technology, I mean software. Although I never tried it, I do believe that using technology is important for “Learning by Doing.” If done right, it can contribute greatly to the spoken-language learning process.
Question: As you know, we teach Spoken English at Saybot in an entirely new way. It is a revolutionary approach to teaching and learning any Spoken language by using advanced technology and the Internet. Moreover, we designed all the products and services especially for Chinese learners of spoken English. Saybot uses the best technological features for participation and interactivity for assisting Chinese people learn how to speak “real” English. What we do is far different form the traditional teaching of English in China. What do you think of this software and the overall Saybot experience?
Idit: The Saybot Company is approaching the teaching of spoken-English in an entirely new way. In fact, it developed a new and revolutionary approach to teaching and learning any Spoken language. Saybot integrates the most powerful and well-known learning theories with powerful new technology in the best possible ways -- to enhance the two key features I discussed earlier: 1) “Learning by Doing,” and 2) “It Takes Two to Tango.”
Moreover, Saybot designed all its first-generation services especially for Chinese learners of spoken English. In addition, Saybot uses the best technological features for creating active participation and interactivity for assisting Chinese people in their learning how to speak “real” English that is relevant for their lives here and now – because they want to find a better job, or travel abroad, succeed in their businesses, or get high TOFEL scores.
What Saybot does do is so far different form the traditional teaching of English in China and from the other organizations like New Oriental and Wall Street English. But on the other hand - it is also complimentary of these other methods. It can work well together, and that’ the beauty of it.
The overall Saybot experience has all the important characteristics that are absolutely essential for quality spoken-language learning: 1) Practicing your real-life speaking; 2) Someone listens and corrects you based on your mistakes; 3) Content is fun, engaging and relevant to your life; 4) It is affordable and easy to use - anytime and everywhere. All you need is an Internet connection and a headset! This is fantastic.
Question: Let’s look into the future, and think about the ways in which Saybot technology and methodology can transform and improve the learning of spoken English in China. Will our technology replace the traditional learning? Or do you think the traditional way will eventually be found better or relatively easier for Chinese people? Is there a contradiction between the two methods, or will they eventually compliment each other?
Idit: Saybot can create a serious revolution, for years to come, in the ways Chinese people approach their learning of spoken English. Its services are so affordable, and easy to access and use, from any where in China. This will also introduce “equal opportunity” to high-quality English learning. It’s on the Net. There are free samples. Everyone can try it. The cost is not high. So eventually everyone will use it in one way or another. All the individuals who would like to improve their English speaking should give it a try. I am serious.
Another nice feature is that Saybot created a technology infrastructure that listens to their customers. From the very beginning, Saybot encourage its customers to send feedback – to praise, to complain, to suggest improvements, and even to suggest content and topics! And Saybot is committed to developing curriculum based on the ideas and demand of their customers. They “pull” not just “push” their own ideas – which is what the new Web 2.0 is all about. Now, show me another company that teaches English in this way?
It is so hard to find a good English teacher in China, who is a fluent native speaker; who can listens and corrects you based on your accent, level, grammar; who can coach you on your terms and at your convenient time! Private tutoring like this, at this level of quality and expertise costs a fortune! And Saybot makes it available for all – which is another one of their great contribution to Chinese society and the development of its citizens, its businesses, and its education.
SAYBOT：在中國(guó)現(xiàn)在有越來(lái)越多的人在學(xué)習(xí)英語(yǔ)，但是有許多人學(xué)了許多年卻仍然不會(huì)說(shuō)英語(yǔ)，您覺(jué)得大的問(wèn)題在哪里？
IDIT：為了更好地學(xué)會(huì)說(shuō)英語(yǔ)，人們應(yīng)該堅(jiān)持練習(xí)英語(yǔ)對(duì)話。許多中國(guó)學(xué)生并沒(méi)有得到充分的口語(yǔ)練習(xí)，因?yàn)樗麄儧](méi)有好的內(nèi)容。閱讀和寫(xiě)做對(duì)英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者來(lái)說(shuō)是非常有用，但是對(duì)口語(yǔ)練習(xí)是不夠的。而且，人們同樣需要提高聽(tīng)力來(lái)幫助他們進(jìn)行口語(yǔ)練習(xí)。后，為了更好地進(jìn)行英語(yǔ)會(huì)話，我們必須熟悉各種發(fā)音，比如：美式、英式、澳大利亞式的英語(yǔ)，以及兒童口音、成人口音和各種行業(yè)的口音，這樣可以用來(lái)掌握各種說(shuō)話的系統(tǒng)并且學(xué)習(xí)怎樣在各種語(yǔ)境和環(huán)境下來(lái)更好地表達(dá)自己。
SAYBOT：有許多人在中國(guó)接受了高等教育，但是他們的語(yǔ)言水平有時(shí)可能不如一個(gè)本土英語(yǔ)國(guó)家的小孩。您覺(jué)得根本的原因在哪里？是根本學(xué)習(xí)方式不同還是其他的原因？
IDIT: 在中國(guó)許多人接受過(guò)高等教育，我們可以看到他們閱讀和寫(xiě)作能力都很不錯(cuò)，但是他們流利清晰地說(shuō)好英語(yǔ)的能力卻很有限。他們?nèi)鄙儆幸饬x的、吸引人的、有趣的內(nèi)容來(lái)練習(xí)口語(yǔ)。我們知道中國(guó)人可以學(xué)好英語(yǔ)，比如你可以去看看那些在美國(guó)留學(xué)的人們——他們真的說(shuō)得很好！所以這是有可能的！
SAYBOT：在我們傳統(tǒng)的英語(yǔ)教學(xué)方法中，我們會(huì)背好多單詞，做好多練習(xí)，許多人為了考試而讀英語(yǔ)。但是在日常生活中，卻使用不出來(lái)，您覺(jué)得我們傳統(tǒng)英語(yǔ)教學(xué)離快速掌握英語(yǔ)的方法有多遠(yuǎn)？
IDIT: 通過(guò)記憶和背誦英語(yǔ)單詞來(lái)學(xué)英語(yǔ)從系統(tǒng)化的角度來(lái)說(shuō)并不是一無(wú)可取的。英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者的確需要通過(guò)一個(gè)詞一個(gè)詞地記憶來(lái)擴(kuò)大詞匯量。但是這一方式必須結(jié)合每天和真人進(jìn)行有關(guān)的生活或工作相關(guān)的有趣的日常會(huì)話，包括聊一些有關(guān)于興趣和愛(ài)好的話題。
我認(rèn)為口語(yǔ)結(jié)合了以下三種系統(tǒng)方法：1）記憶單詞 2）逐詞逐句練習(xí) 3）把新學(xué)到的詞句立刻應(yīng)用到真實(shí)的對(duì)話和解決問(wèn)題的場(chǎng)景中——這是學(xué)習(xí)口語(yǔ)好的方法
我把這種學(xué)習(xí)方法叫做：邊學(xué)邊做。作為學(xué)習(xí)方法學(xué)家，我做了多年的研究發(fā)現(xiàn)那些英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者：無(wú)論是年輕的還是年老的，都不能真正地恰當(dāng)?shù)卣莆蘸蛻?yīng)用新學(xué)的知識(shí)（無(wú)論是數(shù)學(xué)、科學(xué)、技術(shù)、商務(wù)或者語(yǔ)言藝術(shù)等），除非他們能徹底地投入并著手于相關(guān)的活動(dòng)才使這些知識(shí)對(duì)他們個(gè)人來(lái)說(shuō)有有真實(shí)的意義。
SAYBOT：您覺(jué)得怎樣在英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)中，是記憶更重要，還是說(shuō)話更重要？怎樣才能更簡(jiǎn)單地學(xué)英語(yǔ)？
IDIT: 我們學(xué)習(xí)一門(mén)新的語(yǔ)言，好的辦法就是要不斷地說(shuō)！但是記?。翰灰缓妥约赫f(shuō)！語(yǔ)言學(xué)習(xí)者如果他有興趣學(xué)習(xí)口語(yǔ)，好有一位那門(mén)語(yǔ)言的母語(yǔ)者，這樣可以來(lái)傾聽(tīng)他們的對(duì)話，并且告訴他們接近和相關(guān)的表達(dá)方式；本土語(yǔ)言者可以告訴他們對(duì)話中的相關(guān)內(nèi)容，也可以為他們指出語(yǔ)法和發(fā)音中的錯(cuò)誤。他們具有豐富的教學(xué)知識(shí)可以更正他們的口語(yǔ)，鼓勵(lì)他們、幫助學(xué)習(xí)者達(dá)到一個(gè)新的水平。
任何口語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者必須經(jīng)常在日常生活對(duì)話中來(lái)進(jìn)行鍛煉，否則他們很快會(huì)失去熱情中止學(xué)習(xí)。
這就是“邊學(xué)邊做”理論。但是我們也說(shuō)：探戈需要兩個(gè)人才能跳”。也就是說(shuō)兩個(gè)人來(lái)學(xué)習(xí)一門(mén)語(yǔ)言是一種很好的方法。理想的語(yǔ)言學(xué)習(xí)者的身邊需要一位本國(guó)語(yǔ)言者（一個(gè)完美的舞伴），他是一位很好的傾聽(tīng)者，他可以理解你的興趣和動(dòng)機(jī)，他也是一位好的指導(dǎo)者，他知道怎樣不斷地鞭策英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者，使他們進(jìn)行完美的語(yǔ)言學(xué)習(xí)舞蹈！
SAYBOT：目前中國(guó)出現(xiàn)了許多英語(yǔ)培訓(xùn)機(jī)構(gòu)，比如以考試類(lèi)為主的新東方，以提高口語(yǔ)為主的華爾街，您怎么看待這些培訓(xùn)學(xué)校，他們會(huì)給傳統(tǒng)的英語(yǔ)教學(xué)方式怎樣的沖擊？
IDIT：:我沒(méi)有親身體驗(yàn)過(guò)這些特殊的訓(xùn)練中心和他們的語(yǔ)言環(huán)境。所以我不能從親身體驗(yàn)來(lái)評(píng)論他們。但是我聽(tīng)說(shuō)他們收費(fèi)很高。
我認(rèn)為華爾街的英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)以“英語(yǔ)角”而出名，你可以付費(fèi)，可以和真人進(jìn)行真實(shí)的英語(yǔ)對(duì)話，是一個(gè)非常好的形式。我也認(rèn)為華爾街在使用技術(shù)——我指的是軟件。雖然我沒(méi)有使用過(guò)，我認(rèn)為使用技術(shù)“邊學(xué)邊做”的理論是很重要的。如果做得正確，技術(shù)為英語(yǔ)口語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)的過(guò)程帶來(lái)很大的幫助。
SAYBOT：說(shuō)寶堂的口語(yǔ)教學(xué)是比較新型的口語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)方法，它是通過(guò)人機(jī)全方位的互動(dòng)學(xué)習(xí)，來(lái)幫助大家練口語(yǔ)，這種學(xué)習(xí)方式和傳統(tǒng)的英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)方法有了很大的不同。您對(duì)SAYBOT的教學(xué)軟件怎么看？
IDIT：說(shuō)寶堂公司在英語(yǔ)口語(yǔ)教學(xué)中找到了一種完全不同以往的新方法。實(shí)際上，他們創(chuàng)造了革命性的教學(xué)口語(yǔ)方法。說(shuō)寶堂用有效的方式將和有效的學(xué)習(xí)理論用強(qiáng)有力的技術(shù)結(jié)合起來(lái)，因此達(dá)到了前面所說(shuō)的兩大佳學(xué)習(xí)方式： 1）邊學(xué)邊做 2）探戈需要兩個(gè)人來(lái)跳。
而且，說(shuō)寶堂的產(chǎn)品和服務(wù)是為中國(guó)英語(yǔ)口語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者量身定做的。說(shuō)寶堂用好的技術(shù)來(lái)開(kāi)發(fā)設(shè)計(jì)各種全程生動(dòng)的教學(xué)參與和全互動(dòng)課程，這樣可以隨時(shí)隨地幫助中國(guó)人來(lái)學(xué)習(xí)真正地說(shuō)英語(yǔ)，這樣可以幫助他們找到更好的工作、到國(guó)外旅游、在商業(yè)中決勝，或者得到更好的托福成績(jī)。
說(shuō)寶堂和中國(guó)傳統(tǒng)的英語(yǔ)教學(xué)有很大的不同，和其他一些培訓(xùn)機(jī)構(gòu)比如新東方、華爾街也有很大不同。但從另一方面說(shuō)，說(shuō)寶堂的產(chǎn)品結(jié)合了許多優(yōu)秀的英語(yǔ)教學(xué)的英語(yǔ)教學(xué)方式。他與那些傳統(tǒng)的教學(xué)方法和培訓(xùn)機(jī)構(gòu)模式可以互相合作。這也是說(shuō)寶堂產(chǎn)品的美妙之處。
體驗(yàn)了說(shuō)寶堂的產(chǎn)品你會(huì)發(fā)現(xiàn)：它具有所有高質(zhì)量效果英語(yǔ)所具備的一切重要特質(zhì)： 1）練習(xí)真實(shí)的生活對(duì)話 2）有人傾聽(tīng)并及時(shí)糾正你所犯的錯(cuò)誤 3）內(nèi)容非常有趣吸引人，并且和你的每日生活息息有關(guān) 4）可承受的價(jià)格，隨時(shí)隨地便利使用。所有您所做的只要可以上網(wǎng)和一副耳機(jī)！這真是美妙極了。
SAYBOT：您覺(jué)得未來(lái)五年內(nèi)，英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)方法會(huì)有著怎樣的改變？是延續(xù)傳統(tǒng)教學(xué)呢，還是會(huì)有新的方法所代替？?jī)烧咧g是否會(huì)有矛盾？英語(yǔ)教學(xué)的遠(yuǎn)景又是如何？
IDIT: 在今后的年月里，在中國(guó)人學(xué)習(xí)英語(yǔ)口語(yǔ)的歷程中，說(shuō)寶堂在創(chuàng)造一個(gè)極具影響力的革命。他的服務(wù)價(jià)廉物美，使用非常方便，在中國(guó)任何地方都可以使用。他還將 “機(jī)會(huì)均等”介紹給高質(zhì)量的英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)者。在網(wǎng)上有一些免費(fèi)的樣品，每個(gè)人都可以試用。產(chǎn)品價(jià)格不高，所以每個(gè)人多多少少地可以使用。所有想提高英語(yǔ)的人應(yīng)該來(lái)試一下。我非常認(rèn)真自信地來(lái)講這些話的。
另外一個(gè)非常好的特征就是說(shuō)寶堂建立了一個(gè)可以?xún)A聽(tīng)客戶(hù)反饋的技術(shù)框架系統(tǒng)。從開(kāi)始的時(shí)候，說(shuō)寶堂就鼓勵(lì)他們的使用者及時(shí)給他們反饋，可以贊揚(yáng)、也可以抱怨，也可以提供建議，甚至可以建議內(nèi)容和主題！說(shuō)寶堂的課程開(kāi)發(fā)設(shè)計(jì)完全是在用戶(hù)體驗(yàn)的基礎(chǔ)上進(jìn)行的。他們將以客戶(hù)的需求為目的：這集中體現(xiàn)在新的WEB2.0里?，F(xiàn)在，試問(wèn)有沒(méi)有其他的公司做到這一點(diǎn)？
在中國(guó)，找到一位優(yōu)秀的英語(yǔ)老師很不容易，他必須是流利的本土語(yǔ)言者，可以來(lái)聽(tīng)你所說(shuō)的并及時(shí)給你糾正你的發(fā)音、水平和語(yǔ)法，也可以在你的學(xué)習(xí)周期和和你便利學(xué)習(xí)的時(shí)間內(nèi)教你！如果要達(dá)到那樣的水平的私人老師將會(huì)是一大巨大的開(kāi)支！而說(shuō)寶堂把這個(gè)變?yōu)槊總€(gè)人都可以實(shí)現(xiàn)的夢(mèng)想——這也是說(shuō)寶堂為中國(guó)社會(huì)商業(yè)教育的進(jìn)步和發(fā)展所做的另一個(gè)偉大的貢獻(xiàn)！
IDIT: Saybot can help you learing spoken English simplely
Idit Harel is founder, Chairman and CEO of MaMaMedia. Idit Harel has been developing and introducing new-media technologies to kids since the early 80's - the earliest days of the personal computer. One of the first graduates of Harvard's Education Technology Program and the MIT Media Lab, Harel founded MaMaMedia in 1995, in NYC
Question: In China, more and more people are studying English. About 350 million people per year! But a lot of people still cannot speak English well. What do you think the key problem is?
Idit: In order to learn how to speak, a person needs to practice speaking on a regular basis. Most Chinese English-learners do not practice speaking often enough. They have no good contexts for doing that. Learning to read and write can be helpful in the English language learning process, but it is not sufficient for learning to how to speak English. In addition, a person needs to practice listening to English speakers in order to learn how to speak. Finally, in order to speak really well, people must practice listening to many different kinds of accents and pronunciations (e.g., American, British, or Australian; children, adults, or various professionals) and to different kinds of styles of speaking (street-speak, academic-speak, media-speak) and learn to respond and express themselves accordingly to fit with various contexts and situations.
Question: Even among the people in China who received high education, the spoken-English level is much lower than that of young children in any native English-speaking country. What do you think is the essential reason for this phenomenon? Is it the different way they learn English? Any other reasons come to mind?
Idit: Even among the people who received their higher education in China, we can see that they may be able to read and write well, but have limitations in their ability to speak English fluently and clearly. They lack practicing their speaking in meaningful, engaging, and fun contexts. We know Chinese people can learn to speak English well. For example, look at those who came to study in the USA – they speak really well! So it’s possible!
Question: Following the traditional way of teaching English in China, we are often taught to recite and memorize a lot of words, and we do many word-by-word speaking exercises. A lot of people study English words for tests. They may do well on these tests, and their vocabulary may be large, but they cannot speak English in their daily lives. What do you think is the reason for this? What’s the best way to grasp the “real” spoken English?
Idit: Learning to memorize and recite English words in a systematic way is not all bad. English language learners do need to memorize words and practice them through word-by-word speaking exercises, in order to enlarge and enrich their vocabulary. But it must be integrated with additional, daily practicing of speaking with someone real, talking about fun topics from their real daily lives, or work-related topics, or listening and chatting about their interests and hobbies.
I believe that the combination of the three systems – 1) memorizing words, 2) word-by-word speaking exercises, and 3) applying all newly-learned words immediately to real conversational situations or real problem-solving situation -- is the best way to grasp the “real” spoken English.
This philosophy of learning is what I call “l(fā)earning by doing.” My many years of research as a learning theorist indicate that learners, young and old, cannot really appropriate information and own any new knowledge (in mathematics, sciences, technology, business, or in language arts) unless they are thoroughly engaged in hands-on activities that are real and personally-meaningful to them.
Question: Which do you think is more important: 1) receiving good training in the memorizing of words, or 2) in the speaking of real English words and sentences? How we can learn to speak “real” English more easily and more simply?
Idit: We learn a new language best by speaking it. Speaking, speaking, speaking it. But: not just speaking to myself! Language learners, who are interested in learning to speak the language, must have a native speaker who is listening to them, and responds to what they say in a meaningful and relevant way; a native speaker who can relate to the content of the conversation, but can also relate to their specific grammatical mistakes and mispronunciation, and has the pedagogical knowledge of correcting and inspiring their speaking, coaching and taking the learner to the next level.
Any spoken-language learner must experience often, daily, a conversation that is meaningful to him/her, or else they’ll quickly get un-engaged and stop the learning process.
So it is about the “Learning by Doing” theory, but, we also say “It takes two to Tango.” What I mean is that it takes two people to learn to speak a language. Any learner needs a partner on the other side that is a native speaker (an expert Tango dancer), who is also a good listener, who understands the learner’s interests and motivation, and can be a good coach who knows how to continue to engage the learner in the spoken-language learning dance!
Question: There are many successful English-Language Training Schools in China, such as, the New Orient and Wall Street English. What do you regard as the best thing about these training schools? How do they enhance the teaching of spoken English?
Idit: I have never experienced these specific training centers and their learning environments. So I cannot speak about them from first-hand experience. What I heard from others is that they cost a lot and that they are not so good in producing results, that is producing fluent English Speakers.
I think Wall Street English is known for its “English Corners” where you can pay to come to speak real English with real people – so that’s a good feature. I also think Wall Street English uses technology, I mean software. Although I never tried it, I do believe that using technology is important for “Learning by Doing.” If done right, it can contribute greatly to the spoken-language learning process.
Question: As you know, we teach Spoken English at Saybot in an entirely new way. It is a revolutionary approach to teaching and learning any Spoken language by using advanced technology and the Internet. Moreover, we designed all the products and services especially for Chinese learners of spoken English. Saybot uses the best technological features for participation and interactivity for assisting Chinese people learn how to speak “real” English. What we do is far different form the traditional teaching of English in China. What do you think of this software and the overall Saybot experience?
Idit: The Saybot Company is approaching the teaching of spoken-English in an entirely new way. In fact, it developed a new and revolutionary approach to teaching and learning any Spoken language. Saybot integrates the most powerful and well-known learning theories with powerful new technology in the best possible ways -- to enhance the two key features I discussed earlier: 1) “Learning by Doing,” and 2) “It Takes Two to Tango.”
Moreover, Saybot designed all its first-generation services especially for Chinese learners of spoken English. In addition, Saybot uses the best technological features for creating active participation and interactivity for assisting Chinese people in their learning how to speak “real” English that is relevant for their lives here and now – because they want to find a better job, or travel abroad, succeed in their businesses, or get high TOFEL scores.
What Saybot does do is so far different form the traditional teaching of English in China and from the other organizations like New Oriental and Wall Street English. But on the other hand - it is also complimentary of these other methods. It can work well together, and that’ the beauty of it.
The overall Saybot experience has all the important characteristics that are absolutely essential for quality spoken-language learning: 1) Practicing your real-life speaking; 2) Someone listens and corrects you based on your mistakes; 3) Content is fun, engaging and relevant to your life; 4) It is affordable and easy to use - anytime and everywhere. All you need is an Internet connection and a headset! This is fantastic.
Question: Let’s look into the future, and think about the ways in which Saybot technology and methodology can transform and improve the learning of spoken English in China. Will our technology replace the traditional learning? Or do you think the traditional way will eventually be found better or relatively easier for Chinese people? Is there a contradiction between the two methods, or will they eventually compliment each other?
Idit: Saybot can create a serious revolution, for years to come, in the ways Chinese people approach their learning of spoken English. Its services are so affordable, and easy to access and use, from any where in China. This will also introduce “equal opportunity” to high-quality English learning. It’s on the Net. There are free samples. Everyone can try it. The cost is not high. So eventually everyone will use it in one way or another. All the individuals who would like to improve their English speaking should give it a try. I am serious.
Another nice feature is that Saybot created a technology infrastructure that listens to their customers. From the very beginning, Saybot encourage its customers to send feedback – to praise, to complain, to suggest improvements, and even to suggest content and topics! And Saybot is committed to developing curriculum based on the ideas and demand of their customers. They “pull” not just “push” their own ideas – which is what the new Web 2.0 is all about. Now, show me another company that teaches English in this way?
It is so hard to find a good English teacher in China, who is a fluent native speaker; who can listens and corrects you based on your accent, level, grammar; who can coach you on your terms and at your convenient time! Private tutoring like this, at this level of quality and expertise costs a fortune! And Saybot makes it available for all – which is another one of their great contribution to Chinese society and the development of its citizens, its businesses, and its education.